= ReviewerMeeting20090701 =

== summary ==

 * noodles graduates
 * deryck and leonardr are new mentats
 * adeuring to update wiki pages regarding `except Exception`, `KeyboardInterrupt` and `SystemExit`

== logs ==

=== AMEU ===

{{{
Jul 01 10:00:11 <barry>	#startmeeting
Jul 01 10:00:12 <MootBot>	Meeting started at 09:00. The chair is barry.
Jul 01 10:00:12 <MootBot>	Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
Jul 01 10:00:18 *	deryck (n=deryck@samba/team/deryck) has joined #launchpad-meeting
Jul 01 10:00:23 <barry>	hello everyone and welcome to this week's ameu meeting.  who's here today?
Jul 01 10:00:28 <rockstar>	ni
Jul 01 10:00:31 <adeuring>	me
Jul 01 10:00:33 <noodles775>	yup
Jul 01 10:00:35 <henninge>	me
Jul 01 10:00:36 <intellectronica>	אני
Jul 01 10:00:36 <sinzui>	me
Jul 01 10:00:40 <deryck>	me
Jul 01 10:00:43 <gmb>	me
Jul 01 10:00:47 <barry>	good one intellectronica :)
Jul 01 10:01:11 *	gmb keeps needing to remind himself that it's not a problem with X when intellectronica has his keyboard in Hebrew mode.
Jul 01 10:01:22 <cprov>	me
Jul 01 10:01:36 <danilos>	me
Jul 01 10:01:56 <mars>	me
Jul 01 10:01:59 <leonardr>	me
Jul 01 10:02:35 <bac>	me
Jul 01 10:02:41 <mars>	barry, flacoste sends his apologies, he is celebrating Canada's birthday today
Jul 01 10:02:58 <barry>	mars: thanks
Jul 01 10:03:17 <barry>	allenap: ping
Jul 01 10:03:22 <barry>	bigjools: ping
Jul 01 10:03:23 <BjornT>	me
Jul 01 10:03:25 <mars>	barry, and gary is off sick
Jul 01 10:03:27 <barry>	BjornT: ping
Jul 01 10:03:32 <barry>	mars: k, thanks
Jul 01 10:03:38 <allenap>	me
Jul 01 10:03:44 <barry>	EdwinGrubbs: ping
Jul 01 10:04:14 <barry>	[TOPIC] agenda
Jul 01 10:04:14 <EdwinGrubbs>	me
Jul 01 10:04:14 <MootBot>	New Topic:  agenda
Jul 01 10:04:26 <barry>	* Roll call
Jul 01 10:04:26 <barry>	 * Action items
Jul 01 10:04:26 <barry>	 * Mentoring update
Jul 01 10:04:26 <barry>	 * jtv: if code catches `Exception`, make sure `KeyboardInterrupt` and `SystemExit` are not swallowed.
Jul 01 10:04:26 <barry>	 * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
Jul 01 10:04:37 <barry>	[TOPIC] action items
Jul 01 10:04:38 <MootBot>	New Topic:  action items
Jul 01 10:04:46 <barry>	 * intellectronica to email list about higher JS branch limits
Jul 01 10:05:27 <intellectronica>	sorry, i didn't
Jul 01 10:05:35 <barry>	k
Jul 01 10:05:43 <barry>	[TOPIC] mentoring update
Jul 01 10:05:44 <MootBot>	New Topic:  mentoring update
Jul 01 10:05:57 <barry>	first, let's welcome leonardr to our cabal!
Jul 01 10:06:08 <leonardr>	thanks, barry
Jul 01 10:06:16 <rockstar>	leonardr did great last week.  He'll be graduating in no time.
Jul 01 10:06:19 <gmb>	barry: And deryck
Jul 01 10:06:28 *	jtv1 (n=jtv@124.120.192.78) has joined #launchpad-meeting
Jul 01 10:06:29 <barry>	gmb: you type faster than me :)
Jul 01 10:06:33 <gmb>	:)
Jul 01 10:06:34 <barry>	and deryck
Jul 01 10:06:39 <jtv1>	me
Jul 01 10:06:59 <henninge>	jtv1: you're not deryck
Jul 01 10:07:01 <bigjools>	me, sorry
Jul 01 10:07:05 *	jtv1 is now known as jtv
Jul 01 10:07:29 <barry>	also, noodles775 you're graduated!  cprov has nothing but glowing reports.  congratulations
Jul 01 10:07:41 <noodles775>	great! Thanks barry!
Jul 01 10:07:44 <cprov>	noodles775: congrats!
Jul 01 10:07:45 <danilos>	woohoo, noodles775 congratulations!
Jul 01 10:07:49 <henninge>	noodles775: Glückwunsch!
Jul 01 10:07:53 <noodles775>	And thanks cprov for all the time you spend helping me :)
Jul 01 10:08:01 <intellectronica>	congratulations noodles775!
Jul 01 10:08:06 <noodles775>	Cheers everyone :)
Jul 01 10:08:07 <bigjools>	felicitats
Jul 01 10:08:11 <jtv>	congratulations noodles775
Jul 01 10:08:49 <barry>	noodles775: you can stay on thursdays/euros or switch to monday or friday if you want.  you're call and just ping me after the meeting if you want to rearrange your schedule
Jul 01 10:09:03 <noodles775>	barry: will do, thanks.
Jul 01 10:09:13 <barry>	does anybody have any other mentoring items today?
Jul 01 10:09:42 <barry>	k, moving on...
Jul 01 10:09:54 <barry>	[TOPIC]  * jtv: if code catches `Exception`, make sure `KeyboardInterrupt` and `SystemExit` are not swallowed.
Jul 01 10:09:55 <MootBot>	New Topic:   * jtv: if code catches `Exception`, make sure `KeyboardInterrupt` and `SystemExit` are not swallowed.
Jul 01 10:10:06 <barry>	jtv: this will go away in python 2.5 :)
Jul 01 10:10:13 <jtv>	Hmm, that wiki markup doesn't look half as good on irc
Jul 01 10:10:20 <jtv>	barry: are we there yet?  :-)
Jul 01 10:10:32 *	barry looks to flacoste and gary... damn!
Jul 01 10:10:43 <mars>	jtv, barry, why not add a lint tool warning for "catch Exception"?
Jul 01 10:11:07 <jtv>	There is one, actually.  But it's not clear what it wants you to do.
Jul 01 10:11:24 <mars>	jtv, ah, fix the string it spits back at you?
Jul 01 10:11:27 <jtv>	But yes, corollary: once we've upgraded, maybe that should go away :-)
Jul 01 10:11:31 <barry>	does anybody not know what we're talking about here?
Jul 01 10:11:48 <mars>	saying "This is bad" is one thing, saying "This is bad, ensure foobar" is another
Jul 01 10:11:51 <jtv>	mars: right, it just notes that you're catching Exception.  Which isn't the surprising part.
Jul 01 10:11:58 <mars>	:)
Jul 01 10:12:12 <intellectronica>	is there an easy, or at least obvious, way to do that?
Jul 01 10:12:29 <intellectronica>	or should you simply never catch Exception?
Jul 01 10:12:36 <barry>	intellectronica: until py2.5, you need separate except (KeyboardInterrupt, SystemExit) clause
Jul 01 10:12:52 <barry>	intellectronica: catching Exception is way better than a bare except (usually)
Jul 01 10:13:11 <barry>	intellectronica: except that in py2.4, "except Exception" catches KI and SE exceptions too
Jul 01 10:13:36 <barry>	in 2.5 the exception hierarchy was rearranged so that KI and SE are siblings of Exception, not children
Jul 01 10:13:52 <barry>	BaseException is the mother of all exceptions, and it rarely needs to be caught
Jul 01 10:13:54 <intellectronica>	so, except KI: raise \n except SE: raise \n except Exception: stuff... ?
Jul 01 10:14:07 <barry>	intellectronica: yep, or except (KI, SE): raise
Jul 01 10:14:12 <bigjools>	can we just upgrade Python already ...
Jul 01 10:14:26 <barry>	bigjools: yes please
Jul 01 10:14:34 <sinzui>	We need more eggs I think
Jul 01 10:14:34 <jtv>	bigjools: can you have it ready by Monday?
Jul 01 10:14:39 <adeuring>	i think an "except Exception" is in most cases bad as well:, unless you log an OOPS
Jul 01 10:14:51 <bigjools>	jtv: I'll get my wife to do it
Jul 01 10:14:58 <gmb>	adeuring: +1
Jul 01 10:15:01 *	barry hopes we do it before the open source release
Jul 01 10:15:09 <cprov>	adeuring: right, I think that's the rule.
Jul 01 10:15:15 <rockstar>	adeuring, +1
Jul 01 10:15:31 <jtv>	it's right, but we have a few scripts that don't do that.
Jul 01 10:15:48 <barry>	adeuring: certainly, if you as a reviewer see "except Exception" or <gasp> bare-except, you should ask lots of questions
Jul 01 10:16:30 <adeuring>	barry: right; but it can't hurt to update the wiki page ;)
Jul 01 10:16:40 <jtv>	barry: right, that is the real point here.
Jul 01 10:17:00 <barry>	adeuring: sure.  would you or jtv like to take that action?
Jul 01 10:17:10 <adeuring>	barry: I'll do it
Jul 01 10:17:15 <barry>	adeuring: thanks
Jul 01 10:17:21 *	jtv bows to adeuring who beat him to the
Jul 01 10:17:22 <jtv>	*ow!
Jul 01 10:17:44 <barry>	[ACTION] adeuring to update wiki to describe 'except Exception'
Jul 01 10:17:45 <MootBot>	ACTION received:  adeuring to update wiki to describe 'except Exception'
Jul 01 10:18:06 <barry>	adeuring: please also do include info on KI and SE, and that py2.5 changes things
Jul 01 10:18:33 <barry>	[TOPIC] peanut gallery
Jul 01 10:18:34 <MootBot>	New Topic:  peanut gallery
Jul 01 10:18:44 <adeuring>	barry: I'm already wrote a note about that ;)
Jul 01 10:18:45 <barry>	that's everything on the agenda, does anybody have any other topics today?
Jul 01 10:18:51 <barry>	adeuring: thanks :)
Jul 01 10:19:46 <barry>	5
Jul 01 10:19:57 <barry>	4
Jul 01 10:20:05 <mars>	barry, me
Jul 01 10:20:13 <barry>	mars: go ahead
Jul 01 10:20:57 <mars>	so yesterday we had an issue with unescaped HTML data appearing in the browser
Jul 01 10:21:18 <mars>	the fix was to remove a "structure foo" statement from the TAL template
Jul 01 10:21:37 <mars>	given that the TAL "structure" statment is potentially dangerous, should it raise a lint warning?
Jul 01 10:22:00 <intellectronica>	mars:  no, it's used legitimately way too often
Jul 01 10:22:05 <danilos>	intellectronica: +1
Jul 01 10:22:08 <bac>	intellectronica: +1
Jul 01 10:22:12 <mars>	ok
Jul 01 10:22:24 <mars>	barry, that's all then :)
Jul 01 10:22:33 <barry>	mars: thanks
Jul 01 10:22:41 <barry>	anything else guys?
Jul 01 10:23:12 <barry>	5
Jul 01 10:23:24 <jtv>	oh come on already, we've been through that!
Jul 01 10:23:27 <barry>	4
Jul 01 10:23:36 <barry>	3
Jul 01 10:23:38 <barry>	2
Jul 01 10:23:41 <barry>	1
Jul 01 10:23:44 <barry>	#endmeeting
}}}

=== AsiaPac ===

{{{
Jul 01 18:29:39 <barry>	#startmeeting
Jul 01 18:29:41 <MootBot>	Meeting started at 17:29. The chair is barry.
Jul 01 18:29:41 <MootBot>	Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
Jul 01 18:29:46 <barry>	thumper, mwhudson hi
Jul 01 18:30:06 <thumper>	hi
Jul 01 18:30:07 *	leonardr has quit ("Leaving")
Jul 01 18:31:15 <barry>	mwhudson: wanted to speed through today's meeting, so shall we start with a recap of ameu?
Jul 01 18:31:33 <barry>	noodle graduates, deryck and leonardr are new mentats
Jul 01 18:32:02 <thumper>	barry: yep, I ready the backlog :)
Jul 01 18:32:19 <barry>	thumper: ah cool.  i don't need to explain "except Exception" then :)
Jul 01 18:32:39 <thumper>	not to me
Jul 01 18:32:50 <barry>	i'm sure not to mwhudson either
Jul 01 18:33:07 <barry>	other than that. i have nothing on my list.  do you or mwhudson have anything?
Jul 01 18:33:39 <thumper>	one thing
Jul 01 18:33:55 <thumper>	the other day stub landed a method to help printing unicode in doctests
Jul 01 18:33:59 *	thumper looks for the method
Jul 01 18:34:40 <thumper>	hmm...
Jul 01 18:34:49 <thumper>	I recall a commit flying past, but I can't see it in pages.py
Jul 01 18:35:00 <barry>	it rings a vague memory
Jul 01 18:35:10 *	thumper checks loggerhead
Jul 01 18:36:15 <mwhudson>	hi oops sorry
Jul 01 18:36:42 <thumper>	hmm, can't find it right now
Jul 01 18:36:50 <mwhudson>	barry: what was it about except Exception?
Jul 01 18:37:07 <mwhudson>	oh right
Jul 01 18:37:15 *	mwhudson read enough backscroll
Jul 01 18:37:22 <thumper>	r8714
Jul 01 18:37:23 <barry>	mwhudson: cool
Jul 01 18:37:27 <thumper>	added to doctest but not pages
Jul 01 18:38:11 <barry>	that always drives me crazy that they have different globs
Jul 01 18:38:54 <thumper>	a bug should be filed :)
Jul 01 18:39:02 <thumper>	also it needs to move to lp.testing
Jul 01 18:39:46 <barry>	thumper: jfdi man!
Jul 01 18:39:49 <mwhudson>	barry: i heard a rumour that all javascript changes are supposed to be QAed before landing or something
Jul 01 18:39:57 <mwhudson>	barry: do you know anything about that?
Jul 01 18:40:30 <barry>	mwhudson: we talked about that on the list a few weeks ago, but i don't know that anybody has actually done that
Jul 01 18:40:52 <mwhudson>	ok
Jul 01 18:41:18 <mwhudson>	over this side of the world it sometimes seems like decisions on process get made but that noone tells us :)
Jul 01 18:41:36 <barry>	mwhudson: we only do that when we don't follow those decisions ourselves :)
Jul 01 18:42:09 <barry>	but yeah, i hear ya.  hopefully these meetings can help that
Jul 01 18:42:57 <barry>	anything else guys?
Jul 01 18:43:02 <thumper>	nope
Jul 01 18:43:26 <mwhudson>	barry: i guess a single place on the wiki to go and look this sort of thing up would be good
Jul 01 18:43:35 <mwhudson>	barry: maybe there is one already!
Jul 01 18:43:44 <mwhudson>	barry: nothing else
Jul 01 18:44:06 <barry>	mwhudson: agreed!  it should be here if anywhere: https://dev.launchpad.net/Reviews
Jul 01 18:44:14 <barry>	cool.  thanks guys
Jul 01 18:44:20 <barry>	#endmeeting
}}}