= ReviewerMeeting20090923 =

== summary ==

 * please keep your screenshots around long enough to do qa.  either use bug attachments (preferred) or don't clean out rookery so eagerly
 * lp 3.0 is awesome and beuno loves you
 * asiapac meeting moving to 2100utc

== logs ==

=== ameu ===

{{{
10:01:08 > barry: #startmeeting
10:01:10 < MootBot: Meeting started at 09:01. The chair is barry.
10:01:10 < MootBot: Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
10:01:24 > barry: hi everyone and welcome to this week's ameu reviewers meeting.  who's here today?
10:01:43 < danilos: me
10:01:46 < bigjools: me
10:02:28 > barry: wow
10:02:34 < bigjools: everyone must be busy with something else, can't think what
10:03:05 < intellectronica: me
10:03:09 > barry: intellectronica, gary_poster cprov salgado sinzui noodles775 jml allenap EdwinGrubbs rockstar bac ping
10:03:17 < noodles775: me
10:03:19 < jml: hi
10:03:19 < cprov: me
10:03:20 < salgado: me
10:03:21 < bac: barry: apologies
10:03:26 < gary_poster: me
10:03:51 > barry: no worries
10:03:58 > barry: [TOPIC] agenda
10:03:59 < MootBot: New Topic:  agenda
10:04:07 > barry:  * Roll call
10:04:07 > barry:  * Action items
10:04:07 > barry:  * UI review call update
10:04:10 > barry:  * Linked artifacts (e.g. screenshots) from bugs and merge proposals should not disappear [bac]
10:04:14 > barry:  * Peanut gallery (anything not on the agenda)
10:04:14 > barry:  
10:04:17 > barry:  
10:04:21 > barry: [TOPIC] * Action items
10:04:22 < MootBot: New Topic:  * Action items
10:04:29 > barry:  * gary_poster and barry will transfer review guidelines from the old wiki and old old wiki to the new wiki
10:04:34 > barry: postponed until after 3.0
10:04:36 < gary_poster: bah :-)
10:04:37 < EdwinGrubbs: me
10:04:44 > barry:  * cprov to update guidelines to clarify how code sensitive to env changes should be written
10:05:00 < cprov: barry: shhh, sorry again
10:05:19 -!- beuno!n=beuno@canonical/launchpad/beuno has joined #launchpad-meeting
10:05:33 > barry: cprov: no worries
10:05:45 > barry: [TOPIC]  * UI review call update
10:05:47 < MootBot: New Topic:   * UI review call update
10:05:57 > barry: beuno: hi!  would you like to say a few words here?
10:06:00 -!- flacoste!n=francis@canonical/launchpad/flacoste has joined #launchpad-meeting
10:06:05 < flacoste: me
10:06:47 < bigjools: doesn't look like it :)
10:07:06 > barry: it doesn't ;)
10:07:10 > barry: anyway...
10:07:14 -!- henninge!n=henning@canonical/launchpad/henninge has joined #launchpad-meeting
10:07:22 < henninge: me ;)
10:07:25 > barry: [TOPIC]  * Linked artifacts (e.g. screenshots) from bugs and merge proposals should not disappear [bac]
10:07:26 < MootBot: New Topic:   * Linked artifacts (e.g. screenshots) from bugs and merge proposals should not disappear [bac]
10:07:34 < bac: hi
10:07:50 < beuno: barry, hi
10:07:52 < beuno: me
10:07:54 < bac: doing QA i found screenshot links where the item was no longer there.  very frustrating.  that is all.
10:08:00 < beuno: I love you guys
10:08:06 > barry: beuno: :)
10:08:19 < beuno: and you've done an amazing job at 3.0
10:08:30 < intellectronica: bac: best to always use an upload, then?
10:08:35 < beuno: UI reviews went so well, I want them to be done everywhere else
10:08:59 < bac: intellectronica: probably.  or just don't prematurely purge on rookery.
10:09:27 > barry: bac: agreed!  i would also strongly urge people to file a bug, link that bug to your branch, and include demo/qa plan in your cover letter.  as i'm qa'ing things this week i find it very difficult when those things are missing
10:09:53 > barry: beuno: things are looking good, are they not? :)
10:09:55 < jml: also, we should allow attachments on merge proposals.
10:10:20 > barry: jml: +1
10:10:20 < beuno: barry, yes. There are a few "critical" issues on major pages
10:10:25 < beuno: like the bug page, mps and branch index
10:10:34 < beuno: some of them have been addressed
10:10:43 < beuno: and some of them, we won't have time
10:10:52 < beuno: lesson of the day:  don't levae the biggest pages last
10:10:54 < jml: which, of course, means that the merge proposals page should use the same attachment infrastructure as bugs.
10:11:10 > barry: beuno: we're going to have to cp them after the release
10:11:29 > barry: bac has basically said "keep qa'ing but if you find something, it's too late now"
10:11:46 < intellectronica: jml: there are various opportunities to share infrastructure that we should consider now
10:11:49 < beuno: barry, right, it's fixable
10:11:55 < beuno: in general, it's an awesome launchpad
10:12:00 < beuno: all tempaltes have been converted
10:12:00 > * barry is just amazed we actually converted all 375 templates
10:12:05 < beuno: even with me sneaking away for 2 weeks
10:12:06 < jml: barry, me too!
10:12:10 < beuno: you guys rocked the house
10:13:02 < jml: intellectronica, very much so. MPs already use bugs comment infrastructure, largely.
10:13:14 > barry: beuno: can we do a post-mortem after 3.0 is released, and maybe when you're done sprinting, etc. to evaluate the 3.0 process?  and also to think about what needs to be done post-3.0 and what's on the plate for 4.0?
10:13:46 > barry: beuno: it would be great to evaluate what we just did before we leap headfirst into 4.0
10:14:48 < beuno: barry, absolutely
10:15:11 > barry: great!
10:15:19 > barry: [TOPIC] peanut gallery
10:15:20 < MootBot: New Topic:  peanut gallery
10:15:33 > barry: that's everything on the agenda, does anybody else have anything for today?
10:16:10 < flacoste: barry, beuno: we are putting a 3.0 retrospective at the TL meeting
10:16:16 < jml: barry, nope.
10:16:29 < beuno: flacoste, perfect
10:16:36 > barry: jml: i think you're right, so...
10:16:39 > barry: #endmeeting
}}}


=== asiapac ===

{{{
18:30:15 > barry: #startmeeting
18:30:15 < MootBot: Meeting started at 17:30. The chair is barry.
18:30:15 < MootBot: Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
18:30:33 > barry: hello and welcome to this week's asiapac reviewers meeting.  who's here today?
18:30:39 < mwhudson: i am!
18:30:45 < thumper: hey
18:30:52 < wgrant: moi
18:31:01 < thumper: barry: rockstar may be lying down
18:31:04 > barry: excellent
18:31:09 > barry: thumper: cool
18:31:40 > barry: thumper, mwhudson y'know your evil plan to increase the number of antipodeans is backfiring
18:31:52 < thumper: why?
18:31:56 > barry: jml
18:32:11 > barry: ;)
18:32:13 > barry: anyway...
18:32:25 > barry: not much happened in ameu
18:32:32 < mwhudson: the plan hadn't really got far enough that you could call it evil...
18:33:10 > barry: bac requested that folks keep their screen shots around long enough to do qa.  some screen shots were not attached to the bug, but instead were on rookery, and got deleted
18:33:33 > barry: it's recommended to attach them to the bug, or at least keep them around until the end of the cycle
18:33:33 < thumper: I'd like to be able to add attachments to a code review
18:33:39 > barry: thumper: that came up too
18:33:40 < * thumper!n=quassel@canonical/launchpad/thumper adds it to the wish list
18:33:54 < thumper: barry: you can attach them to the mail
18:34:04 < thumper: barry: and we could link them on the UI
18:34:07 < bac: barry:  you woke me up for that?  lies back down to monitor the release
18:34:14 > barry: thumper: yep!
18:34:16 < thumper: barry: the images are stored in the librarian (I think)
18:34:22 < thumper: barry: I'll test
18:34:32 > barry: cool, thanks
18:34:40 < thumper: perhaps not today
18:35:10 > barry: thumper: in the original mp request is probably the most important
18:35:26 > barry: the only other thing from ameu is: lp 3.0 is awesome and beuno loves you
18:36:00 > barry: that's all i have.  what's up with you?
18:36:38 < wgrant: I can no longer complain about the lack of public ec2test.
18:37:04 > barry: wgrant: we have that now?
18:37:09 < mwhudson: well, he does
18:37:17 < mwhudson: it's not actually 'public' yet
18:37:38 > barry: mwhudson: cool
18:37:40 < mwhudson: because i need to land ec2test changes
18:37:41 < thumper: I don't have anything review specific to bring up
18:38:06 < mwhudson: i guess we could mention that review diffs will be a bit different post rollout?
18:38:15 > barry: mwhudson: how so?
18:38:15 < thumper: perhaps
18:38:25 < thumper: pushing will cause the diff to be updated
18:38:27 < mwhudson: they'll update on push
18:38:40 < mwhudson: and they're merge --preview diffs, not diff -r ancestor: diffs
18:38:50 < mwhudson: (so you can get conflicts)
18:39:08 < mwhudson: thumper: are the old diffs kept around?
18:39:16 < thumper: kinda
18:39:21 < thumper: not really
18:39:22 < thumper: yet
18:39:25 > barry: updates are nice
18:39:30 < mwhudson: thumper: there was this idea of linking a code review comment to the diff it applied to, i guess that's not done yet?
18:39:36 < thumper: there is
18:39:40 < thumper: but that is a db patch
18:39:43 < mwhudson: right
18:39:48 > barry: mwhudson: what's the reason behind the merge --preview diffs?  to be explicit about conflicts?
18:40:09 < thumper: that is the only way we can get reasonable diffs
18:40:24 < thumper: barry: because if you merge the target
18:40:34 < mwhudson: barry: conflictyness seems interesting to the reviewer
18:40:35 < thumper: barry: you don't want the merged details in the diff
18:41:14 > barry: thanks.  how does this affect support for dependent branches?
18:41:25 < thumper: heh
18:41:25 < thumper: well
18:41:26 < mwhudson: another thing, jml has this half-written branch that will pull all the details for an ec2 test run from the merge proposal
18:41:28 < thumper: right now they aren't really supported
18:41:44 < thumper: abentley is working on fixing the dependant branch support
18:41:50 < thumper: being renamed to "prerequisite branch"
18:41:53 < mwhudson: which i think will be a useful improvement
18:42:14 < thumper: mwhudson: including commit message?
18:42:26 < mwhudson: thumper: i presume so
18:42:42 > barry: mwhudson: where useful == awesome
18:42:46 < thumper: barry: part of this would be to get LP to somehow work well with pipes
18:42:53 < thumper: barry: have you used bzr-pipelines yet?
18:43:07 < thumper: barry: IMO if you like looms, you'll love pipelines
18:43:11 > barry: thumper: i keep meaning to.  i know they are the official goodness to use instead of looms
18:43:36 < thumper: barry: they just work better with LP as they are branch based
18:43:39 > barry: honestly though, i haven't had many branch stacks during these last two cycles
18:43:45 < thumper: :)
18:44:00 < jml: including commit message.
18:44:09 < jml: it assembles the [r=...] gunk from the mp
18:44:18 < jml: and takes the actual text of the commit message from the mp too
18:44:24 < jml: (but iirc, you can override it)
18:44:41 > barry: jml: my last commit message is usually meaningless, e.g. 'pick some lint' or 'merge rf'
18:44:59 < thumper: barry: the proposal has a commit message field
18:45:15 < thumper: barry: not set very often right now. tarmac uses it
18:45:19 > barry: i'll have to start using that.  i've basically ignored the Subject: field until now
18:45:32 > barry: but it all sounds cool
18:45:35 < thumper: barry: it isn't the subject
18:45:55 > barry: thumper: isn't that last commit message stuffed into the subject in a 'bzr send'?  or is that something else?
18:46:15 < thumper: barry: we don't do anything with that subject
18:46:41 > barry: thumper: that's why i've started to ignore it
18:46:57 < thumper: barry: but the commit message is a different bit
18:48:00 > barry: i have one other thing i'd like to ask y'all
18:48:07 < thumper: shoot
18:48:19 > barry: is this time still the best for the asiapac meetings?
18:48:29 < thumper: still good for me
18:48:35 < thumper: although we change next week
18:48:42 < thumper: daylight savings kicks in
18:48:49 < * thumper:48:54 < thumper!n=quassel@canonical/launchpad/thumper: so becomes one hour later
18:48:55 > barry: personally, i wouldn't mind moving it earlier by an hour (or more) but i want to make sure we continue to meet at a good time for you
18:49:11 < thumper: I'm fine with this time
18:49:15 > barry: thumper: you just blew my mind
18:49:25 < thumper: could be fine an hour earlier too as of next week
18:49:42 > barry: so that means 2130 utc?
18:49:45 < thumper: mwhudson: got any preference?
18:49:58 < thumper: barry: yes
18:50:15 < * mwhudson!n=mwh@canonical/launchpad/mwhudson blinks his attention back, sorry about that
18:50:43 < mwhudson: 2130 utc next week is 0930 local?
18:50:46 < mwhudson: that's fine with me
18:50:47 > barry: i'll probably bitch and moan again by 01-nov when we fall out of daylight savings, but for now that would be great
18:51:00 < thumper: mwhudson: 2130 utc next week is 1030 local
18:51:09 < thumper: mwhudson: daylight savings sunday
18:51:10 < mwhudson: oh right
18:51:18 < mwhudson: that's completely fine
18:51:26 > barry: great!  2130 it is
18:51:29 > barry: that's all for me
18:51:36 < mwhudson: another hour earlier would be ok, though risks bumping into our standup
18:51:42 < thumper: barry: well, in nov it would be another hour earlier for you
18:51:52 < thumper: barry: which would make it what?
18:51:55 < mwhudson: an hour earlier than that would be ok, though that's getting a little early here (0830)
18:52:10 > barry: thumper: i think it would make it 1630 for me which would be perfect
18:52:16 < thumper: mwhudson: I was talking about US going out of daylight savings
18:52:36 < mwhudson: thumper: i'm just being general
18:52:48 < mwhudson: thumper: now jml is off, we can go earlier, is the basic summary
18:52:53 < thumper: right
18:52:55 > barry: right
18:53:12 < thumper: we could do 20:30 utc
18:53:13 > barry: 2130 should be fine now and after 01-nov
18:53:41 > barry: if not, it's good to know we can push it a bit, but probably not necessary
18:53:50 > barry: anyway...
18:53:53 > barry: anything else guys?
18:53:55 < thumper: what about 2100 ?
18:54:05 < thumper: barry: it used to collide withour standup
18:54:09 < thumper: barry: but we moved that
18:54:16 > barry: thumper: ah cool.  2100 is fine too
18:54:22 < thumper: mwhudson: 2100?
18:54:41 < mwhudson: thumper: yes, fine
18:54:50 < thumper: barry, mwhudson: sold!
18:54:56 > barry: beauty
18:55:10 > barry: thanks guys... i think we're done!
18:55:13 > barry: #endmeeting
}}}